Discussions

News: Borland JBuilder 2005 announced

  1. Borland JBuilder 2005 announced (44 messages)

    Borland has announced JBuilder 2005, which will have a GA release in September. This release has support for JDK 1.5, JavaServer Faces, J2EE 1.4 on the Java front. There is also better integration with other Borland products such as OptimizeIt, StarTeam, and CaliberRM.

    Borland Packs New Features into JBuilder

    Borland's new Java IDE JBuilder 2005 to ship in Sept.

    Borland Releases JBuilder 2005

    Threaded Messages (44)

  2. Pricey[ Go to top ]

    Another version already ??? .. I find JBuilder the most bloated IDE
    I have ever used and is too pricey... Eclipse with its free plugins
    is a far better IDE.
  3. Jbuilder rules[ Go to top ]

    Eclipse is an ugly mess with an inconsistent interface, and it lacks so many JBuilders features which no free plug-ins will ever replace
  4. Facts[ Go to top ]

    There are some FACTS people bashing JBuilder do not know:

    - First version of JBuilder was relased 7 years ago. JBuilder is very mature product.

    - JBuilder is NOT proprietary. It has open architecture for plugins (in Borland's vocabulary OpenTools) from the very first version and there are a lot of free as well as comercial OpenTools for JBuilder that adds features that JBuilder lacks (and these are not many!). Also, Borland philosophy is not vendor lock-in oriented, on the contrary! JBuilder is the ONLY IDE that has support for ALL major J2EE servers and most of the major (now for Subversion too) source control systems. As a proof of JBuilder open architecture, Borland has a product called C++BuilderX (platform neutral C++ IDE) that is developed on the same code base as JBuilder called Primetime (language and platform neutral IDE framework).

    - JBuilder is NOT bloated. Everything is lazy loaded and there is support for user profiles that can enable/disable features on per project basis. If you use the feature (GUI Editor, EJB designer, etc.) it will be loaded on the first use.

    - There are THREE versions of JBuilder. Free version is Foundation. Developer version is aimed at the similar user audience as IDEA, with the addition of unmached relational database oriented app development. It costs the same as IDEA. The only pricey version is Enterprise, but it is aimed at the audience that CAN buy it.

    - JBuilder is NOT slow. It complies faster then most of other IDEs due to smart dependency checker. It only starts slow, but the other Java IDEs do too.

    - The last version of JBuilder (X) was released about 10 months before. This is the first version of JBuilder in last 4 years that will not follow 6 months release schedule cycle.

    MC
  5. JBuilder is losing the ground[ Go to top ]

    I have been using JBuilder from version 4.5 and used to be a big fan of it. Unfortunately, it gets larger and larger and buggier. I recommended version X to a big client. And almost everybody in the team hated it due to unexpected crushes and funky behaviors. I was very much embarrassed. For the next project of same client, I decided to switch to MyEclipse. After some curves of initial setups, it works beautifully. For instance, you can change your codes without explicitly deploying to WebLogic 8.1 and see the results right after. You can debug from JSP to EJB beans all through line by line and even change codes on the fly.

    I not only same the client big licensing fees and developers are happier to use MyEclipse.

    No more JBuilder!!!
  6. JBuilder is losing the ground[ Go to top ]

    "I was very much embarrassed"

    Yes, after looking over MyEclipse - so embarrassed for the J2EE community, I really wonder what these Eclipse people are doing with J2EE. Really, IBM just recently got a handle on EJB 2.0 specs. Looks to me, a really good question to ask a potential J2EE developer - Do you use Eclipse for J2EE development?

    >"You can debug from JSP to EJB beans all through line by line and even change codes on the fly."

    Really, darn, I must of been dreaming all the time debugging with JBuilder. Gee, maybe I'm dreaming about writing this reply as well...

    >"JBuilder losing ground"

    Oh my, is Visual Age coming back?
  7. Thanks for the news .. I am really excited about the latest release of JBuilder. I have been desperately trying to figure out JSF support from JBuilder .. and it has finally arrived .. although late but hopefully far better than Sun's JavaStudio or IBM's WSAD. Sun's Java Studio has only support for JSF which makes it difficult to use for EJB. Whereas IBM WSAD provides everything .. but advanced JSF components like JSF tree require use of WDO .. an implementation of SDO which still is a JSR and not included into J2EE 1.4. This makes using advanced JSF components difficult.
    Anyway .. I hope JBuilder will address some of these issues. It will take ages for Eclipse to provide all the features JBuilder has.
  8. Borland JBuilder 2005 announced[ Go to top ]

    http://info.borland.com/media/shockwave/jbuildersneak/jbsneak.html

    And yes its expencive it's slow but i still like using it + together.
    But sometimes i just go IDEA.
  9. Borland JBuilder 2005 announced[ Go to top ]

    Actually it's pretty interesting. I remember myself using JBuilder 6. It didn't slow me down, I was productive. But then I switched to IDEA due to numerous factors. Actually with IDEA I see the same situation as with JBuilder - perfect product in early versions like 3.0, and lots of bells and whistles in 4.x(like GUI builder). Good new features also, but lots of functionality I don't want to have and do not use. I think, I'm not alone in the desire to have a lightweight version of products(both IDEA and JBuilder), oriented to the end hardcore professional developer, who mainly works with code, version control systems and build tools like ant and maven.
  10. Borland JBuilder 2005 announced[ Go to top ]

    with the Foundation version you will have less features ;)
    But yes it would be nice having a stripped version.. perhaps the ability to deselect modules on instalation and configure it so alot of features would disapear from my view.
  11. Borland JBuilder 2005 announced[ Go to top ]

    I prefer NetBeans for this reasom and the next version seems will be very interesting (ant script as project metadata and integrated profiler ), but it is not as fast as I want for some reason.
  12. <vendor>
    For J2EE dev, check out Pramati Studio 3.5.. http://www.pramati.com
    </vendor>
  13. it's all good[ Go to top ]

    I used to use JBuilder, until I started using eclipse and never looked back. having competition is good and it stimulates movement. Though, if I was going to build a new GUI application, I would choose SWT and eclipse. Following eclipse plugin architecture isn't a big overhead and it forces me to code in a flexible way. In the end, the app benefits from a solid plugin architecture.
  14. yes yes yes[ Go to top ]

    Hello people... i too like more Eclipse than JBuilder but is too very good development tool.
  15. EditPlus[ Go to top ]

    EditPlus baby...
  16. Eclipse is the best[ Go to top ]

    VI for me....Not really. I have been using Eclipse for quite a while now and I love it. The plug-in concept allows me to add and take away functionality as I need it. It makes the IDE less complicated. I also use the myeclipseide plug-in for J2EE development and Omondo's UML tools for bi-directional diagrams. This combination gives me everything I need to be effective.
  17. I dumped JBuilder for Eclipse[ Go to top ]

    JBuilder has a major version upgrade every year so that you have to pay for it. They don't fix bugs, they just release new versions. This forces you into a $1k/year support contract. Things move too fast now to get locked in to an IDE.

    Long live Eclipse!
  18. I dumped JBuilder for Eclipse[ Go to top ]

    I also don't know why some one go and buy a Java IDE if there are lot of open source options that are more felxible and better supported than proprietry JBuiler. No offense but I also wonder how JBuilder is surviving in this competitive market just selling the tools and IDE's???
  19. Size Matters[ Go to top ]

    Size matters and in the IDE world smaller is better.

    JBuilder lost me 3 years ago when I switched to Idea. I'm using OptimizeIt but I'm not interested in the integration with the IDE.

    Idea 2.6 was the first reliable debugger I used. I switched for a week to Eclipse but I had to switch back to Idea for a larger project. The Eclipse debugger was too slow. Now I'm using Idea 3.0 which has some features I like but is a little bit slower.
  20. [Opinion] care for vi anyone?[ Go to top ]

    Hello everyone,

    Just out of curiosity, is there anyone/organisation out there using only vi for java development (coding of java classes, xml, jsp, basically everything in vi)?
    I wonder how is the productivity etc.?

    I came to know of a corporation that uses only vi for development. Honestly I was fairly supprised and shocked. Maybe there is something in vi makes this an extra advantage over using other IDEs. I might have misses some points. What do others think about this? Any opinions would be helpful.

    Thanks for sharing the opinions.

    regards
    tmjee
  21. Vi or xemacs?[ Go to top ]

    VI sounds a little bit short on completion for java.
    What about using emacs/xemacs (with the jde toolbar)?
    I spent some time learning Spring using Vim, that is my only (and small) experience. Now I use it for jsp and css only, where I don't need completion. It has the major advantage to me to be fast responding. Eclipse has much powerfull features for java, but is too slow responding when coding web pages.
    When I work on a windows system, I use Ultra-Edit for jsp+css.
  22. JBuilder is not so bad[ Go to top ]

    As J2EE developer, I prefer Eclipse too, but I've also used a few versions of JBuilder (from the Enterprise serie) in my work and I must admit it's a really good IDE. I agree it has a few bugs and a new version is released a bit too often, but it also has nice features. For example, the EJB designer is great for people with less experience in EJBs, it has support for a lot of application servers (and to Borland, support doesn't mean just starting and stopping the AS. It also means good wizards that help in writing and managing the deployment descriptors specifics to the targeted AS). Also, the debugger is quiet good (in all the Java IDE I know, only Eclipse can compete with it). If I had to develop a project in a team with a few developers that have less experience in J2EE and if money is not a problem (after all, what's the price of JBuilder compared to the price of some other softs used in an enterprise), I would definitely choose JBuilder.
  23. RE: JBuilder is not so bad[ Go to top ]

    Hello,

    I'm currently working with (or should I say forced to work with?) JBuilder X in a J2EE project (using WebLogic application server), so here my 2Cents regarding JBuilder.
    [...] it also has nice features. For example, the EJB designer is great for people with less experience in EJBs [...]
    Actually, I think the EJB designer is the most crapiest part of JBuilder. I cannot count the times I had to manually correct deployment descriptors that JBuilder corrupted. I now try to edit the deployment descriptors only "by hand" .Nevertheless, I'm really getting nervous, when I have to save something in the EJB designer I opened by accident. Further, I think that you should not let "less experienced" people develop a J2EE application. You need the appropriate knowledge to implement a J2EE application that really _works_. Just to know how to use the JBuilder Wizard in order ot create EJBs does not make the day (in fact I think that's rather _dangerous_). For example, try to ask those people something about transaktion management for the EJBs they just "implemented".
    [...] Also, the debugger is quiet good (in all the Java IDE I know, only Eclipse can compete with it). [...]
    In fact, I haven't seen any IDE with a non-working debugger, and I've worked with some IDEs so far. So I think, the debugger is not really an outstanding part of JBuilder.
    [...] after all, what's the price of JBuilder compared to the price of some other softs used in an enterprise [...]
    I'm not sure what you mean with "other softs", but I assume you mean the server software, like application servers, databases etc.
    Those software usually does not have to be licensed for developers (I know that for WebLogic, WebSphere, DB2), but for your production-, staging-, integration-environment etc. In contrast to that, you have to license JBuilder for _every_ developer. So if you have a quite large development team, that license costs for JBuilder will exceed the costs of the "other softs" very quickly.
    Further, you have to take into account the costs that JBuilder causes simply by slowing down development. For example building a project I'm currently working on (with a quite large number of EJBs) takes about 30 minutes! Building the same project using Ant from command line takes about 3 minutes. Building the project using Ant from within JBuilder takes abozt 15 minutes (I wonder what the heck is going on there anyway?).

    Best Regards,
        Dirk
  24. RE: JBuilder is not so bad[ Go to top ]

    it also has nice features. For example, the EJB designer is great for people with less experience in EJBs [...]
    Actually, I think the EJB designer is the most crapiest part of JBuilder. I cannot count the times I had to manually correct deployment descriptors that JBuilder corrupted.
    I don't really see the problem here. I suppose you've never crashed your eclipse project ? All the IDE have a few bugs, but when you're used to an IDE you know how to avoid the problems. Moreover, using an SCM tool, you can revert to the latest stable version.
    Further, I think that you should not let "less experienced" people develop a J2EE application. You need the appropriate knowledge to implement a J2EE application that really _works_
    Then how can they get experience to J2EE and become valuable people in the company ? Have you been experienced from the first day ?
    In fact, I haven't seen any IDE with a non-working debugger, and I've worked with some IDEs so far.
    And for how long in Java ? A good debugger is often the most difficult thing to develop in an IDE. In the old days, it was really difficult to find a good Java debugger integrated in an IDE.
    Building the project using Ant from within JBuilder takes abozt 15 minutes (I wonder what the heck is going on there anyway?).
    Have you tried changing the JBuilder VM memory parameters in your JBuilder configuration files ? The default parameters are not always the best ones. As you're deploying to Weblogic you probably already know about those files : when you deploy a large .ear project from JBuilder to Weblogic, the Weblogic deployer runs sometimes out of memory. Changing the VM memory parameters for external tasks is also the way to avoid this problem.
  25. RE: JBuilder is not so bad[ Go to top ]

    it also has nice features. For example, the EJB designer is great for people with less experience in EJBs [...]
    Actually, I think the EJB designer is the most crapiest part of JBuilder. I cannot count the times I had to manually correct deployment descriptors that JBuilder corrupted.
    I don't really see the problem here. I suppose you've never crashed your eclipse project ? All the IDE have a few bugs, but when you're used to an IDE you know how to avoid the problems. Moreover, using an SCM tool, you can revert to the latest stable version.
    Intersting. Why do you assume that I'm an eclipse user? In fact, I usually work at customer's project, so I'm using the IDE the customer has chosen to be appropriate for a project.
    I'm quity astonished about your statement, that it is no problem when your IDE is corrupting some of your source artifacts. Reverting the changes via SCM tools is _definitely_ not an option for me. Usually you notice the changes not right away, but after deploying the application, in worst case in your integration tests.
    To answer the question if eclipse never crashed my project: I have never worked with an IDE that did crash it the way JBuilder X does (JBuilder 9 also). But let me make one thing clear: I'm not generally against JBuilder or pro eclipse (or any other IDE). I disliked eclipse 2.x also, 3.0 seems to be OK, though I have not worked that instensively with it. It liked IntelliJ (JetBrains) IDEA 2.x and 3.x _VERY_ much, but 4.x is over-designed. I even liked the old JBuilder versions, but in the latest versions there are just too many critical bugs.
    Further, I think that you should not let "less experienced" people develop a J2EE application. You need the appropriate knowledge to implement a J2EE application that really _works_
    Then how can they get experience to J2EE and become valuable people in the company ? Have you been experienced from the first day ?
    Accepted, that's a good point! But let me ask you right back: Are they supposed to get more experienced by just using some kind of wizard?
    I think, the companies also have the responsibility to educate their employees. For example, by internal (or external) training programs. Further, it seems to be a good idea to apply the XP practice of pair programming using a less skilled and a skilled developer. At least don't let the less skilled developers do the mission critical stuff _alone_.
    In fact, I haven't seen any IDE with a non-working debugger, and I've worked with some IDEs so far.
    And for how long in Java ? A good debugger is often the most difficult thing to develop in an IDE. In the old days, it was really difficult to find a good Java debugger integrated in an IDE.
    For how long in Java? Let me think... must have been about 7 years now.
    Building the project using Ant from within JBuilder takes abozt 15 minutes (I wonder what the heck is going on there anyway?).
    Have you tried changing the JBuilder VM memory parameters in your JBuilder configuration files ? The default parameters are not always the best ones. As you're deploying to Weblogic you probably already know about those files : when you deploy a large .ear project from JBuilder to Weblogic, the Weblogic deployer runs sometimes out of memory. Changing the VM memory parameters for external tasks is also the way to avoid this problem.
    The current setting is 512m initial heap, 1024m max heap. The deployment and appc of the modules isn't the problem. I guess most time gets lost in some strange tasks like "preparing module...".


    Best regards,
        Dirk
  26. RE: JBuilder is not so bad[ Go to top ]

    Why do you assume that I'm an eclipse user?
    I'm not assuming anything. I just give an example of something I know by experience wasn't perfect in another IDE (though it seems to be better in the latest versions). It could also have been another IDE than Eclipse. I know JBuilder is far to be perfect, but the perfect IDE doesn't exist. Is JBuilder really as bad as some people says in this thread ? Having used a few IDE, I don't think it is that bad. I even think it is currently one of the best with the current Eclipse and previous versions of IDEA (yes, I've used that one too ;-) and netbeans seems to improve fast (but I've never really used that one). Also, some people in this thread are saying Visual Age was awful. I've also used it in the past and, for Swing developments, it was far better than JBuilder (with Visual Age, the designer was visually building new JavaBeans from the components you were using -> components were independent of others and the code was much cleaner. Consequently, reusability was much better).
    I'm quity astonished about your statement, that it is no problem when your IDE is corrupting some of your source artifacts. Reverting the changes via SCM tools is _definitely_ not an option for me.
    It's not an option for me either : it's just most of the time the fastest way to get back a working project. Of course, I agree, you shouldn't have to do it, but I don't yet know about any IDE that never crashed anything in the project from time to time.
    But let me make one thing clear: I'm not generally against JBuilder or pro eclipse (or any other IDE). I disliked eclipse 2.x also, 3.0 seems to be OK, though I have not worked that instensively with it. It liked IntelliJ (JetBrains) IDEA 2.x and 3.x _VERY_ much, but 4.x is over-designed. I even liked the old JBuilder versions, but in the latest versions there are just too many critical bugs.
    I mostly agree. It's true that Borland should spend more time fixing bugs, but I don't think the bugs in JBuilder are so desastrous. Also, I'm not sure the latest versions have more bugs. They're probably just more visible. About the old versions, have you used JBuilder 3.5 ? It was the first version written in Java ... and also the worst one to me. I still wonder how they've been able to fix all the problems for the version 4.
    Are they supposed to get more experienced by just using some kind of wizard?
    No, but it helps in making them more productive.
    I think, the companies also have the responsibility to educate their employees. For example, by internal (or external) training programs. Further, it seems to be a good idea to apply the XP practice of pair programming using a less skilled and a skilled developer. At least don't let the less skilled developers do the mission critical stuff _alone_.
    I totally agree. At least that's how it's supposed to be in a perfect world. Unfortunately, for a financial manager, two workers on the same thing often means one worker doing nothing.
    In fact, I haven't seen any IDE with a non-working debugger, and I've worked with some IDEs so far.
    And for how long in Java ? A good debugger is often the most difficult thing to develop in an IDE. In the old days, it was really difficult to find a good Java debugger integrated in an IDE.
    For how long in Java? Let me think... must have been about 7 years now.
    Enough to know the Java debbugers in the IDE haven't always been that good then.
  27. I used to hate jBuilder until version 8 I think... but with 9 and especially jBuilder X, it has a lot of improvement for functionality and speed.

    For many release I tried eclipse and a few plug-ins but it never came as close to jBuilder for ease of use. Especially for EJB devellopement. The EJB Designer saves you lots of time, even if you're not an EJB beginner.

    jBuilder may not be the best IDE if you do GUI but for Server developpement that works right of the box it's the best one. Yeah yeah there's 62 plug-ins you could install and configure individually, and install them in the correct order for eclipse to be as good, but that's too much time wasted.
  28. Borland JBuilder 2005 announced[ Go to top ]

    Our company switched from JBuilder 6 to Eclipse more then 2 two years ago. We are more then happy with our choice. JBuilder slow, costly tool that does not worth its money. There are plenty of Java IDEs tool that are free or almost free that far more better then JBuilder.
    JBuilder is java IDE for "VB programmers", that do not know and do not understand basic of J2EE programming and are not able to do a thing without "magic" IDE.
    Eclipse is tool for professionals. It is fast,has very powerful refactoring, does not have redundant features and is very flexible and extendable through tons of plugins.
  29. Our company switched from JBuilder 6 to Eclipse more then 2 two years ago. We are more then happy with our choice. JBuilder slow, costly tool that does not worth its money. There are plenty of Java IDEs tool that are free or almost free that far more better then JBuilder. It is fast,has very powerful refactoring, does not have redundant features and is very flexible and extendable through tons of plugins.
    Perhaps a few facts are worthwhile here rather than just the usual anti-JBuilder tirades that are so typical of this forum. I presume you do not realize that since JBuilder 10, there has been a Foundation edition which is the equivalent in functionality to the Eclipse product (well, better in some areas, not quite a good in others). The Foundation is FREE for Commercial use. It isn't open source - but it is free. Is it SWT based, well no - very little is. JBuilder has been around for longer, and is Swing based - is it fast, I think so. I have used Eclipse (for a little while, it just annoyed me) and I didn't really notice the difference in speed.
    JBuilder is java IDE for "VB programmers", that do not know and do not understand basic of J2EE programming and are not able to do a thing without "magic" IDE.Eclipse is tool for professionals.
    I'm not sure I would agree with you. There are plenty of professional programmers out there who do VB development, millions more than Java. Take for example the Dependency Injection joke comic that was on here recently - how many professional programmers in the marketplace would get that without going and looking up Martin Fowlers Dependency Injection explanation - and how many of them would understand it even after they had read it? How many VB programmers?

    You are calling these people "not professional" when I think you mean "not leading edge Java developers". And since Java is mostly prevalent in the corporate world (which is offshoring like mad), I suspect those VB programmers are going to outnumber Java programmers even more in the future (as they are more popular in small to medium sized organisations).

    Does JBuilder Developer/Enterprise/Studio have advanced capabilities for those that don't want to spend endless hours of time "in the code"? Sure it does. Does it try and simplify those things that are "difficult" about J2EE/SOA applications development without seemingly esoteric configuration files and javadoc markers? Sure it does. But then, so does WSAD. Does it integrate really nicely with the rest of the Borland ALM (modeling, management, etc), sure it does. It appeals to a certain segment of the marketplace - not obviously to most of the people who whinge on here, but just like WSAD, it appeals to those who just want to do their job and not get involved in the tedium of J2EE software development.

    Is that a "professional" programmer? Sure it is. Are there "better" ways to do things, more portable between IDEs, etc? Sure there are. But for some people, in fact, a good many people, JBuilder will do the job better than Eclipse simply because it simplifies things.

    One of the other complaints which is hilarious on here - that JBuilder is released so often - why is this a problem? Look at the new versions, upgrade if you want the features, don't if you don't want them. What serious development organisation doesn't purchase software maintenance anyway? Most of the features focus on supporting new functionality demanded by the user base - JSF for example, and improving communication and productivity in corporate teams.

    I use JBuilder for all of my Java development - but I don't use ALL of it either. Can I switch off the stuff I don't want? Sure - development profiles have existed since version 9 I think it was, do I bother? No, JBuilder lazy-loads, so if I don't use it, it isn't loaded generally anyway.

    JBuilder is a cool product - but is it what you need? If you are just comparing it to Eclipse - you'd only be comparing it to the Foundation edition anyway, so the answer is probably not (if you are already using that tool). But all commercial Java development tools have their niche, I expect that JBuilder Studio isn't yours. Does that make a Studio developer less professional than you? Nope, less leading edge potentially, but not less professional.

    Richard
  30. Look, I don't like Eclipse, its just that simple. I owe it to my clients to stay above propaganda and use the best possible tool. I've been using JBuilder for my J2EE development for 3 years now and the other IDE's are not even close. So, I use JBuilder, but I don't bash Eclipse. It’s very easy to review your development requirements and choose the best appropriate tool. For me, I use, Corba, Web Services, Real J2EE development with "Entity Beans" and complex deployments for large distributed environments. JBuilder provides complete support for everything just mentioned and, of course, more if needed.

    Without exception, if you need industrial strength Java tool for your business requirements, JBuilder is it!

    Now, I will not engage in useless propaganda noise - just compare the technical "facts"...
  31. My coworkers and I are using IBM Websphere Studio Application Developer version 5.1.1 to build J2EE applications. IBM WSAD 5.1.1 is based upon Eclipse 2.1.2

    WSAD is OK. I am looking forward to WSAD 6.0

    When I'm working on open source projects at home, I use Eclipse 3.x + JBoss + the JBossIDE

    (BTW, I recently upgraded from Eclipse 3.0 to Eclipse 3.1 M1)
  32. JBuilder is good[ Go to top ]

    Many folks complain that Java developers dont have ".NET VS comparable" IDE but at the same time they bash JBuilder and praise VI and Eclipse. What MS VS has that JBuilder doesnt ?

    Others are unhappy about vast amount of XML descriptors/build files they have to write. If they use Notepad then it's their choice !

    Every IDE has it's own strong and weak points:

    JBuilder is very good for J2EE (EJB/WS/JSP) and SWING GUI development.
    IDEA is great for non-J2EE development.
    For JSF WYSIWYG development I would choose SUN Studio Creator.
    WL Workshop is very productive tool for WEB services.
    ...
  33. You are calling these people "not professional" when I think you mean "not leading edge Java developers". And since Java is mostly prevalent in the corporate world (which is offshoring like mad), I suspect those VB programmers are going to outnumber Java programmers even more in the future (as they are more popular in small to medium sized organisations).Does JBuilder Developer/Enterprise/Studio have advanced capabilities for those that don't want to spend endless hours of time "in the code"? Sure it does.
    no it doesn't. whatever you name it, 'professional' or 'leading edge', the truth is that such a developer doesn't need all those wizards, creators, generators, integrators, etc... in professional development there are many better (more flexible, reliable, useful etc) tools for redusing 'in the code' time. ant, maven, xdoclet...
    for example, what's the point in defining separate build process just for specific ide tool, when there is need for one unified, configurable and global build&deploy process for sake of production releases or test purposes?
  34. no it doesn't. whatever you name it, 'professional' or 'leading edge', the truth is that such a developer doesn't need all those wizards, creators, generators, integrators, etc...
    Professionals know to do without wizards, generators, etc. but also recognise when and where using them will increase their productivity and thus the profitability of their operations.

    Professionals use the best tools they can get and don't let themselves be caught in using vi because vi is "pure" in some academic sense (yet at the same time they WILL use vi when that is the best tool for the job, like when needing to change a single line in a file in which case loading a heavier environment will just take too long).

    The religious zealots are the ones I'd venture to call the least professional (and yes, that includes some people highly regarded as gurus in the industry) for their attitude if not their knowledge and expertise.
  35. Borland JBuilder 2005 announced[ Go to top ]

    JBuilder is java IDE for "VB programmers", that do not know and do not understand basic of J2EE programming and are not able to do a thing without "magic" IDE.Eclipse is tool for professionals.
    This I would consider as a big joke. I know tons of professionals(those are good at java) use JBuilder. Please don't give generic comments based on your narrow perspective.
  36. Borland JBuilder 2005 announced[ Go to top ]

    JBuilder is java IDE for "VB programmers", that do not know and do not understand basic of J2EE programming
    How patronising!

    JBuilder saves me loads of time (= money) not having hand code all the XML DDs. Think it's worth it for the EJB designer and relationship creator for Entity Beans. Especially as I use exclusively CMP 2.0.
  37. Borland JBuilder 2005 announced[ Go to top ]

    I've worked on more than 20 J2EE projects and I think I know J2EE quite well. I would not like to think of myself as a "VB programmer" - what ever that is supposed to mean. I've used a number of IDEs on these projects and I've found that in most cases developing EJBs with JBuilder is significantly easier than with the other IDEs. I still use JBuilder for almost all of my development work (occaisionally emacs). It might be because I'm too old and slow to learn a new IDE but then it's just not that important to me. JBuilder lets me get my work done in a productive manner. I haven't seen anything in Eclipse or IDEA that makes me think "Gosh I could be so much more productive with that feature". On the other hand, I would not want to do complex EJB projects with any more than a couple of stateless beans using an IDEA that doesn't support and understand EJB.

    An IDE should be chosen on the basis whether it supports your desired architecture. It doesn't matter which one you use as long as it supports the architecture and doesn't hinder the development process - preferably it enhances it and makes your more productive. I have seen a project that was designed to use EJB for various reasons but because the developers chose an IDE that didn't support EJB (IntelliJ) they didn't implement it according to the architecture. This led to significant rework further down the track purely because of poor IDE choice.
  38. Java is all about choice[ Go to top ]

    You can code Java with VI, Eclipse, Netbeans, Slick Edit , JEdit, IDEA or JBuilder to name a few you can pick from and what suits you best. Unlike .Not you are not tied to Monopoly of M$.

    Java gives you choice to run in any app server that suits your requirement or even any OS like Linux, UNIX, OS390, AS400 .
  39. Good but Bad[ Go to top ]

    Being a Technical Architect, I work sometimes work with upto 10 projects in concurrent manner. Switching between projects or creating a project puts me off in eclipse owing to it's eager load architecture. It's a pain waiting for an hour, just to load a 50 MB source project. Jbuilder scores a big point here.

    But then Jbuilder is getting just too expensive, specially when the company lacks a true customer friendly upgrade policy.
  40. Good but Bad[ Go to top ]

    Being a Technical Architect, I work sometimes work with upto 10 projects in concurrent manner. Switching between projects or creating a project puts me off in eclipse owing to it's eager load architecture. It's a pain waiting for an hour, just to load a 50 MB source project.
    Can you elaborate?

    Have you tried Eclipse 3.0?
  41. Good but Bad[ Go to top ]

    Being a Technical Architect, I work sometimes work with upto 10 projects in concurrent manner. Switching between projects or creating a project puts me off in eclipse owing to it's eager load architecture. It's a pain waiting for an hour, just to load a 50 MB source project.
    Can you elaborate? Have you tried Eclipse 3.0?
    I'm using Eclipse 3 at the moment, with 3 20MB source projects.
    Eclipse takes about 5 minutes to load and the same again to shut down.
    About once every 10-15 minutes it just hangs for up to a minute. Screen goes all white and leaves you waiting for whatever it is Eclipse thinks is more important than my productivity.
    Good time to drink something or take a break, maybe they inserted some RSI prevention features in it but I don't think so.

    I'd love to switch back to JBuilder, which I abandoned for Eclipse in 2002 when the company I worked for went under and I consequently could no longer afford to upgrade (and no, I don't buy each new version, I went from 3.0 to 4.0 and was thinking of getting 6.0 or 7.0 after that).
    Current company has no budget for development tools at all so we use Eclipse because it's free (everything else too is either free or created in-house except for standard applications like Windows, Office and virus scanners).

    If I had the budget privately (I'm still repaying debts I built up to pay the rent when I went unpaid for half a year and on unemployment benefits for half a year after that) I'd upgrade to the current (or next) JBuilder in an instant (yes, Borland does not have a policy of forcing you to keep upgrading or loose the upgrade rights like many others do).

    JBuilder slow? Not in my experience.
    Sure JB4 ran slowly on my Celeron 400 laptop with 64MB RAM but it did run (especially after adding another 128MB).
    I doubt any major Java based application will run quickly on it, I know Eclipse 2 runs slowly on it as well (slower than JB4 did in fact).
    On a 750MHz+ machine with 521MB RAM JB4 runs very well indeed.
  42. Middleware stack independent[ Go to top ]

    Whatever tool you use there is an aspect of lock-in because over time you will get so used to using it when developing Apps. The great thing about JBuilder and Borland in general is that they are not interested in using this lock-in in order to push a middleware agenda. Sure they have middleware but it is not the core part of there business.
  43. I am big JBuilder fan. I still use it personally Foundation edition for Swing based applications. First and last time I bought JBuilder was about 3 years back. Version 5. It became piece of crap with release of J2SE 1.4. And now in less than 3 years it is Version X + 1 = 2005. Looks like they don't care for Minor Versions. Wish economy grew at this rate. Even Java in 8 years of public releases has reached to Version 5.0 (1.5).

    I would personally prefer JBuilder if provided by Client (Most Preferred IDE for Swing). For refactoring, I would anytime prefer Eclipse.

    But recently I tried NetBeans 4.0 preview. It has changed a lot. A fast and drag-free app. Appearance has changes dramaticaly including better editor and project management. Though it had bugs, but as we know it is still in development. But by the first quarter of if it provides J2EE feature (J2EE 1.4) it is not bad for FREE. The important thing is that will provide support for J2SE 5.0 and Refactoring during final release.

    Even Eclipse is now working on support for J2EE.

    So looking into this in next 6 months or to a year, will JBuilder or IDEA be worth spending money on? May be yes, if they come with additional excellent features and support. They are great tools tho.

    I will bet on Eclipse and Netbeans and looking into in next 6 months as poor and middle class developer's IDE.

    I will prefer NetBeans 4.0 than other absolutely Freeware tools. But currently Eclipse is great with some already available plugins (MyEclipseIde-Subscription).

    So what is next step in FreeWare tools. Integrated UML support with current IDE's? That will be a great idea. Open Source is afterall not bad. Right?

    Cheers
  44. I purchased JBuilder 3.0 when I was an independent consultant because at the time many places I would consult didn't have an IDE. My hope at the time was they would see what JBuilder would do and decide to purchase it. I purchased the professional version, but it didn't take long before I was being forced to buy upgrades every six months with the cost of upgrades costing more than my original puchase. Once I reached version 5 I reluctantly decided I had enough and have abandoned it for good. Although Borland has a really good product, it is becoming increasingly bloated and expensive. It seems as though they are going after those with deep pockets, and their free Foundation edition has always been weak. In my opinion the two best IDEs I have seen are IntelliJ and Eclipse and would be happy to use either one.
  45. The war of IDE's[ Go to top ]

    The two best IDE's out there are JBuilder and Idea. The only problem with JBuilder is the $$$. Even if you upgrade, it still costs a lot of $$$. Hence my move to Idea. As for the open source IDE's, keep them ...if you are going to spend 8 hours a day in front of your machine, you want something that works fast, looks good and does what you want it to do.... but hey, that's just my opinion.