Sun Java System Application Server 8 2004Q4 Available

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News: Sun Java System Application Server 8 2004Q4 Available

  1. Sun Java System Application Server 8 2004Q4 is the latest J2EE 1.4 platform compatible application server from Sun; it builds on the 8 Platform Edition, released in March 2004, which was the first J2EE 1.4 compatible implementation.

    This release adds the Standard and Enterprise editions providing horizontal scalability, a host of high availability features, improved security, ease of management and across the board performance improvements.

    >>Read More

    Rich Sharples
    Sun Microsystems Inc.

    Threaded Messages (32)

  2. Way to go Sun. I have used the previous version of this product (Platform, Standard and Enterprise). It's pretty good.
  3. Release notes[ Go to top ]

    Sun Java System Application Server Platform Edition 8 2004Q4 Release Notes

       http://docs.sun.com/source/819-0072/relnotes.html
  4. Why?[ Go to top ]

    Why yet another server? (so they can say me too?)

    Tomcat is just fine.

    .V
  5. Why?[ Go to top ]

    As soon as you deploy an EJB in Tomcat, please let us know :-)
  6. Why?[ Go to top ]

    Why yet another server?
    No. Yet another update to an existing product. Nothing wrong with that.
  7. Why?[ Go to top ]

    Or maybe Jetty ...
  8. Clarification: This is beta software.[ Go to top ]

    Just to clarify: This is beta software (as you immediately see when you click the link provided).
  9. Yes this is beta[ Go to top ]

    Just to clarify: This is beta software (as you immediately see when you click the link provided).
    Yes this is a beta announcement - looks like the title was truncated - could someone @ TSS change the title to make that clear.

    Rich Sharples
    Sun Microsystems
  10. Is this Serious App Server[ Go to top ]

    I never heard any one using Sun App server(neither for development nor production). Some time back in 2000 I heard about people using IPlanet. Is this the same.
    Iam confused because sun has habit of changing project names very often and confusing products(like forte,netbeans,sun one studio creator,...(some IDE to create jsf))
    Is this comparable to Weblogic,websphere and pramati.?
    Please excuse my ignorance.
  11. Is this Serious App Server[ Go to top ]

    Yes.

    Yes we have had our share of names - NetDynamics, Forte, iPlanet, SunOne and now Java Enterprise System - some of these were acquisitions and the names stuck around for a while, others were just name changes - excuses, excuses ;)

    You may want to take a look at the recent survey from TMC and the
    ensuing discussion on TSS.

    Rich Sharples
    Sun Microsystems
  12. Is this Serious App Server[ Go to top ]

    Yes.Yes we have had our share of names - NetDynamics, Forte, iPlanet, SunOne and now Java Enterprise System - some of these were acquisitions and the names stuck around for a while, others were just name changes - excuses, excuses ;)You may want to take a look at the recent survey from TMC and the ensuing discussion on TSS.Rich SharplesSun Microsystems
    So which of the 3 or 4 app server code bases does this come from? What's new and improved?
  13. Is this Serious App Server[ Go to top ]

    Yes.Yes we have had our share of names - NetDynamics, Forte, iPlanet, SunOne and now Java Enterprise System - some of these were acquisitions and the names stuck around for a while, others were just name changes - excuses, excuses ;)You may want to take a look at the recent survey from TMC and the ensuing discussion on TSS.Rich SharplesSun Microsystems
    So which of the 3 or 4 app server code bases does this come from? What's new and improved?
    For the last couple of years now (since 7.0 was released) the core of the application server is largely based on the J2EE SDK (Reference Implementation), but it also includes Sun's Message Queue product as the JMS provider and the Standard and Enterprise Editions use the scalable HTTP engine from Sun's web server.

    New features over 7.x include better support for clustering in the admin console and command line, J2EE 1.4 support, entirely new administration model for multi-machine deployments, JNDI browser, log viewer, descriptor viewer, JMS broker clustering, improved load balancer administration, improved administration of HA session layer, better monitoring, better performance, etc.

    The list is long but don't take my word for it - sign up for the beta and decide for yourself.

    Rich Sharples
    Sun Microsystems
  14. Is this Serious App Server[ Go to top ]

    Isn't this what eBay runs on?
  15. Is this Serious App Server[ Go to top ]

    I don't know about eBay, but I have worked on version 7 inside of Department of Defense. The developers all use Platform Edition and the production environment used Enterprise Edition clustered.
  16. Is this Serious App Server[ Go to top ]

    Within the last year(ish) I worked at 2 places using it in one form (name) or another. VERY large Corporations.
  17. Is this Serious App Server[ Go to top ]

    I never heard any one using Sun App server(neither for development nor production)
    There is a good reason you never hard of his. Look at the production share of this vs Tomcat or others:
    http://news.netcraft.com/archives/2003/04/10/java_servlet_engines.html

    (abocve is not a marketing sponsored what was sold, but what is in production).

    .V

    ps: IMO, the reason Sun has Java problems is that they deal with technology, and not many users.
  18. Is this Serious App Server - YES !!!![ Go to top ]

    I never heard any one using Sun App server(neither for development nor production)
    There is a good reason you never hard of his. Look at the production share of this vs Tomcat or others:http://news.netcraft.com/archives/2003/04/10/java_servlet_engines.html(abocve is not a marketing sponsored what was sold, but what is in production)..Vps: IMO, the reason Sun has Java problems is that they deal with technology, and not many users.
    Vic, as you clearly couldn't be bothered reading the article you cite; let me do it for you and point out a rather major deficiency - it specifically states that the numbers are incomplete; excluding (partly or wholly) sites running IIS, NES, SunONE or Apache makes the report almost useless. Judging Sun's (Java) software business by the the size of the JavaWebServer market (which was EOL'd Feb 2001) is not that smart.

    Rich Sharples
    Sun Microsystems
  19. Is this Serious App Server - YES !!!![ Go to top ]

    ... excluding (partly or wholly) sites running IIS, NES, SunONE or Apache makes the report almost useless. Judging Sun's (Java) software business by the the size of the JavaWebServer market (which was EOL'd Feb 2001) is not that smart.Rich SharplesSun Microsystems
    IIS and Apache are not Java servers, so not included. The numbers are production #'s done scietificaly by pinging each web site to see what it is runing, and not a sponsored study. A sponsored study would say" this #'s are acurate". Also marketing people say this is how many people bought this, (who cares) vs how many deployed it sucessfully in production (I care).

    For example:
    http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph/?host=1up.com
    This is a site I did with 10MM members, used to run ASP, now it's Resin. 6 servers for load balancing.


    Yes, you should read it. Feb 2001? Wrong! Date is on there.

    Point is, very few production uses relative to Tomcat, etc. which matches anecdotal evidence.

    I wish Sun would use Tomcat, Linux, Opteron and then I think the Stock price would move out of the $3 range.

    .V
  20. Is this Serious App Server - YES !!!![ Go to top ]

    ... excluding (partly or wholly) sites running IIS, NES, SunONE or Apache makes the report almost useless. Judging Sun's (Java) software business by the the size of the JavaWebServer market (which was EOL'd Feb 2001) is not that smart.Rich SharplesSun Microsystems
    IIS and Apache are not Java servers, so not included. The numbers are production #'s done scietificaly by pinging each web site to see what it is runing, and not a sponsored study. A sponsored study would say" this #'s are acurate". Also marketing people say this is how many people bought this, (who cares) vs how many deployed it sucessfully in production (I care).For example:http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph/?host=1up.comThis is a site I did with 10MM members, used to run ASP, now it's Resin. 6 servers for load balancing.Yes, you should read it. Feb 2001? Wrong! Date is on there.Point is, very few production uses relative to Tomcat, etc. which matches anecdotal evidence.I wish Sun would use Tomcat, Linux, Opteron and then I think the Stock price would move out of the $3 range. .V
    Let me make my point a bit clearer, the survey doesn't include NES, iPlanet or SunONE Web or Application Servers - these product lines are representative of Sun's share in the web-container market - the only thing from Sun that this survey counts is JavaWebServer - which was EOL'd in Feb 2001.

    FYI there are a number of ways to run JSPs and Servlets in IIS - including running Resin in IIS.

    Rich Sharples
    Sun Microsystems
  21. Is this Serious App Server - YES !!!![ Go to top ]

    the only thing from Sun that this survey counts is JavaWebServer
    Agree that you can't validate all sites runing, but it's a valid statistical sample to extrapolate from, becuase same is true of Tomcat, you can't see all Tomcat sites becuase they could be fronted by Apache, but we see some.

    ... so I do development for large web sites. In order for me to recommend "Sun" branded comodity, what are some sites that are runing production (in some verifiable way) ?


    .V
  22. Is this Serious App Server - YES !!!![ Go to top ]

    so I do development for large web sites. In order for me to recommend "Sun" branded comodity, what are some sites that are runing production (in some verifiable way) ?.V
    Some of the busier / bigger sites using I know of (note this isn't all pure JSPs and Servlet - I know some of these sites also use CGI / PHP in the mix) :

    http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph/?host=cnn.com

    http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph/?host=www.gm.com

    http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph/?host=www.mlb.com

    http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph/?host=www.sprint.com

    http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph/?host=www.telefonica.es

    http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph?site=www.fidelity.com

    http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph/?host=www.axa.co.uk

    http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph/?host=my.aol.com

    http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph/?host=www.psa-peugeot-citroen.com

    http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph?site=www.standardandpoors.com

    http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph?site=raytheon.com

    and in case you were wondering :

    http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph?site=www.sun.com


    Rich Sharples
    Sun Microsystems
  23. Is this Serious App Server - YES !!!![ Go to top ]

    Thanks Rich.

    And as you said, these are not using Java and the link shows it.
    The study I linked showed actual sites using Java (which would be in proportion of market share) and you gave a sales answer about people using Netscape. Why not show Apache then vs Netscape, which netcraft does, if Sun is competing w/ Apache server, and not Tomcat. See the study shows the Market share of IBM and Oracle Java servers, of produciton sites using JSPs or Servlets (vs ASP or PHP).

    This shows to me that again that Sun can't market, not many will buy Sun like that.
    http://www.sun.com/servers/entry/v40z + Linux would do better, if open standards was the message. Right now the major message is "we are propratiory but that is good, like MS" and minor message is "we also have some open standard stuff if you realy want that, but you should not want it, use IBM for that".

    I wish Sun was an integrator of Linux + Opteron + Tomcat. Like why do I have to install Tomcat on Linux, it should come w/.

    .V
  24. ...but it's a valid statistical sample to extrapolate from...
    Come on, Vic, you're killin' me! All this angst and bitternes can't be too good for you either. Look, anyone making a business decision based on that "valid statistical sample" is a bozo. Oracle runs on three times the number of IP addresses that BEA does? I suppose everyone should just write off JBoss since they didn't even make it into the report. The report itself goes to great lengths to say that its data should be ingested with a huge sodium chloride chaser. Anyway, what you should really be ranting about in this thread is how Sun is squandering their development resources on useless server products when they should be focused on fixing Web Start ;-).

    By the way, does Sun get any credit for changing the way they've licensed the J2EE reference implementation? Are there free app server products available from BEA, IBM, and Oracle that can be run in production?

    What do you mean by "Free"?

    Oh, one other thing:
    I wish Sun was an integrator of Linux + Opteron + Tomcat
    So, here's a box that supports up to four AMD Opterons and will run Solaris, Linux, and/or MS Windows:

    Sun Fire V40z Server

    I don't know that it specifically comes with Tomcat, but it does come with JES.

    Sorry, really the last thing:
    And as you said, these are not using Java and the link shows it.
    That's not what Rich said and how do the links show that Java is not being used? Are you saying that a "Server" response header of "SunONE WebServer 6.0" conclusively proves that the server's not using Java?
  25. Kris,
    Sorry to be killing you, you should not be taking this too serious at all; I don't.

    "Are you saying that a "Server" response header of "SunONE WebServer 6.0" conclusively proves that the server's not using Java?"
    Did I say that? Where?
    And show me some servers that say that? (I saw links for netscape).

    If you want to see Netscape vs Apache, here it is:
    http://news.netcraft.com/archives/web_server_survey.html
    (scroll down a bit and see the past share and curent share of "Sun's" servers and MS vs Open Sorce). We were talking Java in production estimates.
    Sun has minimal market share is what the evidence points to, and so does public Sun stock price.

    I am all for AMD + Linux from Sun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    .V
  26. Believe me, you're not killing me because I'm taking it seriously. What you said was:
    ...these are not using Java and the link shows it
    You tell me, how does "the link show it"? Anyway, forget "SunONE WebServer 6.0" since it's from Sun's own site. Let's go with cnn.com instead. It returns "Netscape-Enterprise/6.1 AOL". Now, let's find some doco on that...got it:

    Sun ONE Web Server 6.1 Collection

    Looks like it supports Servlet 2.3 and JSP 1.2. So how can you say that Rich's links are for sites that don't use Java?
    We were talking Java in production estimates
    And my contention is that neither of the Netcraft links you've provided is worth basing business decisions on. I guess I can understand trying to use them to rationalize a decision you've already made...
  27. Is this Serious App Server - YES !!!![ Go to top ]

    Thanks Rich.And as you said, these are not using Java and the link shows it.
    Vic, I DID NOT say they were NOT using Java - I said they weren't exclusively Java. I don't know if you're a bit hard of thinking or just plain lazy but if you go to one of those sites and view the returned source or dig around a bit you will see they all use Java (just not exclusively).

    Rich Sharples
    Sun Microsystems
  28. You Win[ Go to top ]

    There is no such diging neded to find out Tomcat, Resin and IBM sites in the survry, it's plain. Any one of them could be fronted by Apache but some are not in some proportion. All I saw plainly was Netscape sites. I will not be recomending Sun "app. server" myself, but others are free to (so you can quote me: "Vic OK's other's to recommend Sun app. server" :-0 ). I would be recomending Sun Opteron + Linux depending on the local sales guys being SlowLaris centric or open, what with the quality of people that left SunW.
    Hope this chat did not upset you to much,

    I will let Sun guys "win" by having the last word on your next post.

    .V
  29. You Win[ Go to top ]

    There is no such diging neded to find out Tomcat, Resin and IBM sites in the survry
    I wonder if that would be because the report itself explicitly states that the data set is incomplete. In other words, it doesn't reflect the reality of deployed systems. So, how much digging do you have to do to find JBoss in the survey?
    I will let Sun guys "win" by having the last word on your next post.
    For the record, I'm not a "Sun guy", does that mean I can't "win"?
    I would be recomending Sun Opteron + Linux...
    I'm much more intrigued these days by Solaris 10 than I am by Linux. Sun also seems pretty dedicated to OpenSolaris. Although I'm sure there will be a large debate about exactly what "open" means when applied to the resulting Solaris product...
  30. This survey is not very useful[ Go to top ]

    Look at the production share of this vs Tomcat or others:http://news.netcraft.com/archives/2003/04/10/java_servlet_engines.html(abocve is not a marketing sponsored what was sold, but what is in production).
    This is not a very meaningful survey because it excludes all those sites which run Java application servers behind Apache, IIS and iPlanet. The fact is sites which using Java application servers tend to be larger company (such as our company which is a bank) and they usually put the Java application servers behind the Web server for higher level security.
  31. This survey is not very useful[ Go to top ]

    What is a good survey?

    .V
  32. I look forward to using it![ Go to top ]

    I look forward to using it later this year. I would love to see some benchmarks though. The nice part is it doesn't cost an arm and a leg (unlike WebSphere)
  33. I've used Sun Java application server on two projects and would like to get certified in it. Unfortunately, the certification exists for version 6.0 and not for 7.0 or more