NetBeans IDE 4.1 now in Beta; adds J2EE 1.4 support

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News: NetBeans IDE 4.1 now in Beta; adds J2EE 1.4 support

  1. The NetBeans IDE 4.1 Beta is available for download. Slated for final release in May, v4.1 adds built in support for J2EE 1.4 and Web services development. Sun takes aim at Eclipse in also offering an "Import from Eclipse Module", and takes a jab at Eclipse saying that NetBeans allows J2EE and Web services development "without having to search for an array of plug-in modules".

    Links:
    NetBeans 4.1 Download.
    New J2EE features in NetBeans 4.1.
    Switch to NetBeans IDE program.
    NetBeans 4.1 Beta press release.

    Threaded Messages (51)

  2. Saw the same post 2 weeks ago I guess...
  3. Saw the same post 2 weeks ago I guess...

    Hmm... you're right. That was for early access 2. This is the final beta?

    Floyd
  4. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    I was a long term netbeans user, but the whole time I watched the groundswell of support for eclipse building, and knew eventually I would have to change.

    Now almost every vendor/ open source project releases their tools for eclipse, with idea second, and jbuilder + netbeans way back in third.

    I always liked netbeans, but find it hard to believe it will be able to build a community to compete with eclipse.
  5. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    I was a long term netbeans user, but the whole time I watched the groundswell of support for eclipse building, and knew eventually I would have to change.Now almost every vendor/ open source project releases their tools for eclipse, with idea second, and jbuilder + netbeans way back in third.I always liked netbeans, but find it hard to believe it will be able to build a community to compete with eclipse.
    I choose tools based on their merit, not on the amount of hype or the size of the fanclub. Eclipse STILL doesn't have the features I need and the plugins are lame.
  6. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    I was a long term netbeans user, but the whole time I watched the groundswell of support for eclipse building, and knew eventually I would have to change.Now almost every vendor/ open source project releases their tools for eclipse, with idea second, and jbuilder + netbeans way back in third.I always liked netbeans, but find it hard to believe it will be able to build a community to compete with eclipse.
    I choose tools based on their merit, not on the amount of hype or the size of the fanclub. Eclipse STILL doesn't have the features I need and the plugins are lame.
    I'm guessing with such an open display of ignorance you must be trolling, but hey, sometimes it's fun to bite.
    You don't think the size of a community around an open source project is relevant? I differ with you on this one. Personally I rate the community around an open source project a hell of a lot _more_ important than non critical features.

    As for "the plugins are lame" - I understand one reason eclipse won out over netbeans is because of a better plugin architecture.
  7. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    I was a long term netbeans user, but the whole time I watched the groundswell of support for eclipse building, and knew eventually I would have to change.Now almost every vendor/ open source project releases their tools for eclipse, with idea second, and jbuilder + netbeans way back in third.I always liked netbeans, but find it hard to believe it will be able to build a community to compete with eclipse.
    I choose tools based on their merit, not on the amount of hype or the size of the fanclub. Eclipse STILL doesn't have the features I need and the plugins are lame.
    I'm guessing with such an open display of ignorance you must be trolling, but hey, sometimes it's fun to bite.You don't think the size of a community around an open source project is relevant? I differ with you on this one. Personally I rate the community around an open source project a hell of a lot _more_ important than non critical features.As for "the plugins are lame" - I understand one reason eclipse won out over netbeans is because of a better plugin architecture.

    The problem with Eclipse is that it is not so much an IDE, as a platform on which you build your own IDE using plugins. For example, if you are doing J2EE development then you can't sensibly use Eclipse as shipped - you will need extra tools. You can't compare Eclipse with NetBeans. That is not comparing like-with-like. You have to compare Eclipse + J2EE development plugin + Swing designer plugin etc., as NetBeans has these as part of the base install.
  8. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    The problem with Eclipse is that it is not so much an IDE, as a platform on which you build your own IDE using plugins.

    1) Why is that a problem?
    2) Why would users care how it's built?

    The only thing that matters to users who are not plug-in/RCP developers (99% of them I would guess) is that the IDE be responsive and allow them to get their job done.

    Based on the size of the community, the amount of traffic that the mailing-lists/forums get every day, which is nothing short of extraordinary, I am not really surprised to see that whenever I see someone praising NetBeans or bashing Eclipse, their email address usually ends in sun.com (you might be the only NetBean fan who's not a Sun employee, though :-)).

    At this point, it doesn't even matter how good NetBeans is any more.

    --
    Cedric
  9. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    Why would you care about Eclipse forums if you're not a plugin developer??? The "community" and the "forums" are no argument for 90% of developers.
  10. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    Why would you care about Eclipse forums if you're not a plugin developer??? The "community" and the "forums" are no argument for 90% of developers.
    You mean that Netbeans users do not have a forum to ask questions, neither they form any helpfull community ?
    Is that what you are trying to say ?
  11. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    No, I don't mean that. My post was a reply to another post that suggested the size size of the community and forums was an important reason for choosing Eclipse over NB. I just meant to say this is no argument.
  12. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    The problem with Eclipse is that it is not so much an IDE, as a platform on which you build your own IDE using plugins.
    1) Why is that a problem?2) Why would users care how it's built?The only thing that matters to users who are not plug-in/RCP developers (99% of them I would guess) is that the IDE be responsive and allow them to get their job done

    Exactly. This is why the issue of plug-in requirement matters. I know of some companies that are standardising on Eclipse, but if you are a J2EE developer or a Swing or SWT developer or a J2ME developer, this is a meaningless statement. If you wish to standardise you also have to standardise on a particular plugin for each of these technologies. There are then issues such as whether each of these plugins are dependent on particular versions of Eclipse. I know this from recent experience, as I tried out recent versions of Eclipse to test the Java 5.0 support, but this left me unable to use certain plugins as the developers were not keeping up with these Eclipse versions - some plugins would not work at all, others became buggy.

    There is much about Eclipse I like, but as downloaded, it is incomplete for anything but the most basic development. The presence of such a wide range of plugins has benefits, but does raise significant support and version issues.
  13. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    Exactly. This is why the issue of plug-in requirement matters. I know of some companies that are standardising on Eclipse, but if you are a J2EE developer or a Swing or SWT developer or a J2ME developer, this is a meaningless statement. If you wish to standardise you also have to standardise on a particular plugin for each of these technologies. There are then issues such as whether each of these plugins are dependent on particular versions of Eclipse. I know this from recent experience, as I tried out recent versions of Eclipse to test the Java 5.0 support, but this left me unable to use certain plugins as the developers were not keeping up with these Eclipse versions - some plugins would not work at all, others became buggy.There is much about Eclipse I like, but as downloaded, it is incomplete for anything but the most basic development. The presence of such a wide range of plugins has benefits, but does raise significant support and version issues.
    Fair point.

    From my experience, organizations will tend to create their own distributions containing verified versions of plug-ins and deploy these site-wise.

    At any rate, this is hardly Eclipse's fault, except maybe for offering a powerful plug-in architecture that more and more developers are building upon.

    If anything, I prefer to have too many plug-ins to choose from than not enough.

    --
    Cedric
  14. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    Exactly. This is why the issue of plug-in requirement matters. I know of some companies that are standardising on Eclipse, but if you are a J2EE developer or a Swing or SWT developer or a J2ME developer, this is a meaningless statement. If you wish to standardise you also have to standardise on a particular plugin for each of these technologies. There are then issues such as whether each of these plugins are dependent on particular versions of Eclipse. I know this from recent experience, as I tried out recent versions of Eclipse to test the Java 5.0 support, but this left me unable to use certain plugins as the developers were not keeping up with these Eclipse versions - some plugins would not work at all, others became buggy.There is much about Eclipse I like, but as downloaded, it is incomplete for anything but the most basic development. The presence of such a wide range of plugins has benefits, but does raise significant support and version issues.
    Fair point.From my experience, organizations will tend to create their own distributions containing verified versions of plug-ins and deploy these site-wise.At any rate, this is hardly Eclipse's fault, except maybe for offering a powerful plug-in architecture that more and more developers are building upon. If anything, I prefer to have too many plug-ins to choose from than not enough.-- Cedric
  15. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    Exactly. This is why the issue of plug-in requirement matters. I know of some companies that are standardising on Eclipse, but if you are a J2EE developer or a Swing or SWT developer or a J2ME developer, this is a meaningless statement. If you wish to standardise you also have to standardise on a particular plugin for each of these technologies. There are then issues such as whether each of these plugins are dependent on particular versions of Eclipse. I know this from recent experience, as I tried out recent versions of Eclipse to test the Java 5.0 support, but this left me unable to use certain plugins as the developers were not keeping up with these Eclipse versions - some plugins would not work at all, others became buggy.There is much about Eclipse I like, but as downloaded, it is incomplete for anything but the most basic development. The presence of such a wide range of plugins has benefits, but does raise significant support and version issues.
    Fair point.From my experience, organizations will tend to create their own distributions containing verified versions of plug-ins and deploy these site-wise.At any rate, this is hardly Eclipse's fault, except maybe for offering a powerful plug-in architecture that more and more developers are building upon. If anything, I prefer to have too many plug-ins to choose from than not enough.-- Cedric

    I agree. But, I think my point stands, which is that a direct comparison between Eclipse and other IDEs, such as NetBeans is not really that useful in terms of evaluating what most developers actually need for day-to-day use in most projects.

    I think what is likely to happen long terms is illustrated by some new features in NB 4.1 - an acceptance that Eclipse is out there and very successful, and so tools will be provided for migration from Eclipse, and perhaps even to work with continuing Eclipse projects.
  16. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    I've used Eclipse for the past couple of years and certainly haven't been impressed by the quality of the plugins. And I am not aware of the size of the community. So these did not factor in my choice of Eclipse. I used it because it simply was better at its core than Netbeans, that's all (performance, look and feel, etc.).

    But now, I must say, Netbeans is catching up. I was impressed by their last release, the Swing-based UI is snappy. It still lags a bit in the intuiteveness dept., but for the rest, it's on par with Eclipse.
  17. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    I was a long term netbeans user, but the whole time I watched the groundswell of support for eclipse building, and knew eventually I would have to change.Now almost every vendor/ open source project releases their tools for eclipse, with idea second, and jbuilder + netbeans way back in third.I always liked netbeans, but find it hard to believe it will be able to build a community to compete with eclipse.

     I don't think Netbeans can compete with Eclipse at all. Netbeans is too much Java centric. Eclipse is language neutral (even if it has been developed in Java). You can use Eclipse for Java development, but also for C/C++, or Python, Cobol, UML, PHP ... People on TheServerSide.com many times forget there is a big world outside Java, much bigger than the java world actually.

     Anyway I'm one of those who still think Bash, textutils and cog (http://www.nedbatchelder.com/code/cog/) overtake Eclipse, Netbeans and any other GUI environment at hand.
  18. too late perhaps?[ Go to top ]

    I was a long term netbeans user, but the whole time I watched the groundswell of support for eclipse building, and knew eventually I would have to change.Now almost every vendor/ open source project releases their tools for eclipse, with idea second, and jbuilder + netbeans way back in third.I always liked netbeans, but find it hard to believe it will be able to build a community to compete with eclipse.
     I don't think Netbeans can compete with Eclipse at all. Netbeans is too much Java centric. Eclipse is language neutral (even if it has been developed in Java). You can use Eclipse for Java development, but also for C/C++, or Python, Cobol, UML, PHP ... People on TheServerSide.com many times forget there is a big world outside Java, much bigger than the java world actually. Anyway I'm one of those who still think Bash, textutils and cog (http://www.nedbatchelder.com/code/cog/) overtake Eclipse, Netbeans and any other GUI environment at hand.

    Just a point of information:
    http://cpplite.netbeans.org/
    C++ Support for NetBeans.
  19. C support[ Go to top ]

    Of course cpplite does not work with recent versions of nb ...
    nor do cpp or sbtools, which to me personally is a major nuisance.

    If anybody knows of any other way to teach nb 4.x C (at least for source code editing - I'm not even asking for autotools support ;S ) here's a grateful audience.

    Karl.
  20. C support[ Go to top ]

    Of course cpplite does not work with recent versions of nb ...nor do cpp or sbtools, which to me personally is a major nuisance.If anybody knows of any other way to teach nb 4.x C (at least for source code editing - I'm not even asking for autotools support ;S ) here's a grateful audience.Karl.

    Have you tried posting this to the Netbeans forums? I have found them useful.
  21. Buggy[ Go to top ]

    I spent the afternoon implementing a J2EE application with a Web-App/Servlet and a couple of MDBs and found that after the a few deployments that the bugs started... (Windows XP, JDK1.4.2_06, Sun App Server 8.1)

    I liked Netbeans for plain Tomcat development, and like alot the ease at which one can build and configure J2EE applications, but the integrated deployment is too buggy to rely on.

    I also have been trying to get the Eclipse framework to do the same with the WTP Project plugins and all the others that are painfully not distrubuted and it also is a RPITA, and buggy.

    Guess you gotta pay for this stuff if you want it to work :-(
  22. Buggy[ Go to top ]

    I spent the afternoon implementing a J2EE application with a Web-App/Servlet and a couple of MDBs and found that after the a few deployments that the bugs started... (Windows XP, JDK1.4.2_06, Sun App Server 8.1)

    Please say more about the bugs. We are in intensive bug fixing mode right now.

    Thanks
  23. Buggy[ Go to top ]

    Environment Debian sarge
    JDK 1.5

    On startup netbeans throws a SocketException.

    When creating a web application it doesnt finish the wizard saying "value too long for datatype".

    Well, i just thought i would give it a try, it is definitely much faster than eclipse, no doubt, but doesnt work too well with 1.5. I am pretty happy with it as i am not too concerned about moving to 1.5 right now.
  24. Buggy[ Go to top ]

    Environment Debian sargeJDK 1.5On startup netbeans throws a SocketException.When creating a web application it doesnt finish the wizard saying "value too long for datatype".Well, i just thought i would give it a try, it is definitely much faster than eclipse, no doubt, but doesnt work too well with 1.5. I am pretty happy with it as i am not too concerned about moving to 1.5 right now.

    Hmm, I running Debian too, mixed testing/unstable and haven't run into issues like this. Will check again tomorrow at work
  25. Buggy[ Go to top ]

    I downloaded netbeans 4.1(with sunappserver) and tried the j2ee example for Timer Services. It does not seem to work. I always get the error message "EJB Timer service not available"(I did start the pointbase database).
  26. Yep, that's what I am doing at the moment. I've used Eclipse since its inception. For the past couple of months, I have been developing on Linux, with Eclipse crashing 6 times a day on it. Lately (actually, a couple of days ago), I thought I'd try Netbeans (I had always thought it was very bad, but recent comments have encouraged me into giving it a try).

    Guess what: the experience (although short), has been very positive so far. Setting up what they call a "free form" project is not very intuitive because you have to hook up your own build files to the IDE, even for such tasks as running a single "main" class or unit test through a right-click. But I found some docs on their site, added some of my own spice, and got it running (if anyone is interested, I could post a little how-to complement in this thread).

    But if you go passed the initial hurdle, boy the whole thing is very impressive. Very fast (at least, on Linux, it is way faster than Eclipse, and I would be tempted to say that it should approach Eclipse on Windows...). Very stable too, responsive. They've revamped it (copied the project perspective from Eclipse), so you're not lost.

    I did not think I'd be saying this, but it don't seem like I'll be switching back...

    Yanick
  27. By all means, I'd love it if you could post some tips.
  28. I've used Eclipse since its inception. For the past couple of months, I have been developing on Linux, with Eclipse crashing 6 times a day on it.

    I develop exclusively on Linux (now with Fedora Core 2, Sun JDK 1.5.0_01, kernel 2.6.11); I've used Eclipse since its inception too and never experienced a single crash using the various version of Eclipse (now 3.0.1).

    Daniele
  29. I'm on Fedora Core 1. Maybe that's the problem... Anyway, give Netbeans a try, it is impressive.
  30. NetBeans vs Eclipse[ Go to top ]

    I'm on Fedora Core 1. Maybe that's the problem... Anyway, give Netbeans a try, it is impressive.

    Thanks for your advice Yanick: In the past I've developed with NetBeans (the last version I've used is 3.4.6) but I've been forced to switch to Eclipse for two reasons:
    1) while developing heavly multithreaded CORBA/XMLRPC applications, the debugger of NetBeans stopped working after some times (I've even submitted a bug somewhere in the NetBeans site...)
    2) Eclipse has more refactoring options and I cannot live without them.

    Regards,
         Daniele
  31. NetBeans vs Eclipse[ Go to top ]

    No worries, man, no need to go on a therapy for Eclipse addiction. I'd probably still using it if I hadn't had my problems. Don't feel bad about it ;-)
  32. Converting to NetBeans 4.1[ Go to top ]

    I would like to convert to NetBeans 4.1, but sadly I use NetBeans 3.6 and there is no upgrade path available.

    Until NetBeans can convert my projects I see no reason to go through the hassle of recreating all my projects mannually. In fact I'm even looking at Eclipse.

    Robert
  33. Converting to NetBeans 4.1[ Go to top ]

    I would like to convert to NetBeans 4.1, but sadly I use NetBeans 3.6 and there is no upgrade path available. Until NetBeans can convert my projects I see no reason to go through the hassle of recreating all my projects mannually. In fact I'm even looking at Eclipse. Robert

    Create a new NetBeans 4.1 project, and select 'Project with existing sources' from the appropriate project category (e.g. Web project). This should work fine. It is the same as for NetBeans 4.0. The migration guide is here:
    http://www.netbeans.org/kb/articles/transition-40.html#setup
  34. NetBeans is great[ Go to top ]

    I hope NetBeans continues it's growth and stability & not just take the lead & end up like Eclipse at the moment (always a year behind I think)...

    NetBeans has everything I need it to do at the moment & I have no problems running it on WinXP SP2 w/ JDK 1.5
    Plus I think it should run better with the 1.5 JRE & not the merlin releases.

    I'm a bit worried about this article though
    "http://www.devx.com/opensource/Article/27502" I hope all tries NetBeans 4/4.1 too and compares which is best for them & not follow the crowd (whom most are new to Java dev anyway).

    Unless Eclipse has a good future release w/ outstanding functionality & features I don't think I'll be using it.
  35. NetBeans is great[ Go to top ]

    I'm a bit worried about this article though "http://www.devx.com/opensource/Article/27502"

    Don't worry. It's just more Eclipse hype. Eclipse, the IDE, is half-decent for being free, but it doesn't live up to all the hype. "The end is nigh! The end is nigh!" Actually, no it's not.
  36. NetBeans is great[ Go to top ]

    Don't worry. It's just more Eclipse hype. Eclipse, the IDE, is half-decent for being free, but it doesn't live up to all the hype. "The end is nigh! The end is nigh!" Actually, no it's not.
    I stand corrected, sometimes, Eclipse bashing also comes from a different domain than sun.com :-)

    Come on guys, public bashing a competitor is not professional and always backfires.

    Whatever happened to competing on technical excellence instead of mudslinging?

    --
    Cedric
  37. NetBeans is great[ Go to top ]

    Come on guys, public bashing a competitor is not professional and always backfires.

    Doesn't this directly contradict the following:
    I am not really surprised to see that whenever I see someone praising NetBeans or bashing Eclipse, their email address usually ends in sun.com

    and isn't
    Whatever happened to competing on technical excellence instead of mudslinging?-- Cedric

    contradicted by:
    At this point, it doesn't even matter how good NetBeans is any more.
  38. NetBeans is great[ Go to top ]

    I stand corrected, sometimes, Eclipse bashing also comes from a different domain than sun.com :-)

    Oh, give me a break. I've never bashed Eclipse and never will. It's the hype that I'm addressing.
    Whatever happened to competing on technical excellence ...?

    We already do that very well, IMO. Now it's about raising awareness. And don't mind if I do ride the Eclipse hype to spread the word.
  39. I realize this is a completely subjective question, but can you guys comment on which of these might be a better IDE for a new Java developer but a Microsoft veteran? In essence, can anyone articulate which IDE has a smaller ramp up curve in learning the IDE?

    I am completely new to Java based projects and do understand packages in the form of JARS, WARS, EARS, etc., but I wonder which of these two IDE's is the most straight forward in trying to manage the Microsoft equivalent of projects and solutions?

    Thanks ahead of time for your responses.
  40. I realize this is a completely subjective question, but can you guys comment on which of these might be a better IDE for a new Java developer but a Microsoft veteran? In essence, can anyone articulate which IDE has a smaller ramp up curve in learning the IDE?I am completely new to Java based projects and do understand packages in the form of JARS, WARS, EARS, etc., but I wonder which of these two IDE's is the most straight forward in trying to manage the Microsoft equivalent of projects and solutions?Thanks ahead of time for your responses.

    I would suggest you try NetBeans at first, simply because it as all the tools to build Jars, WARs etc. built-in as soon as you install the IDE. There is also a Swing GUI designer built in.

    Of course, I'm biased, as I like NetBeans. Eclipse is definitely worth a look too.
  41. Needs Hibernate Plugin[ Go to top ]

    Whats with all the Hibernate pluguin devlopment being done for Eclipse exclusively ? I can't seem to find any Hibernate plugin that works for anything other than Eclipse.
  42. Needs Hibernate Plugin[ Go to top ]

    There is one for IDEA
  43. The common saying 'only damn fools stand in the way of an oncoming train' applies here. NetBeans IDE has come along way but frankly today it's just a slow, fat, buggy run of the mill IDE. To make matters worse it has way much less features than Oracle JDeveloper, Eclipse and Intellij. Any half decent developer out there can confirm this. EclipseCon was a sold out conference, the writing's on the wall. By the way the "Top 10 Reasons to Switch to NetBeans" is truly lame (eg. #6 it's Fast. #8 It's cool).

    But there's a silver lining. The NetBeans Framework.
    NetBeans folks, open your eyes. You need to radically rethink the IDE. You're sitting on a potential gold mine but you're blinded by Eclipse. The IDE war has been lost, it's now Eclipse vs. Intellij with Eclipse gaining momentum and mind share. So it's time to go back to developers and ask them really what they want. They want more than what they already have with Eclipse. What I want as a developer is to stop wasting time coding. Think about that for a moment, I don't want to waste time coding and I'm not talking about VB wannabe Creator.
  44. The common saying 'only damn fools stand in the way of an oncoming train' applies here. NetBeans IDE has come along way but frankly today it's just a slow, fat, buggy run of the mill IDE. To make matters worse it has way much less features than Oracle JDeveloper, Eclipse and Intellij. Any half decent developer out there can confirm this. EclipseCon was a sold out conference, the writing's on the wall. By the way the "Top 10 Reasons to Switch to NetBeans" is truly lame (eg. #6 it's Fast. #8 It's cool).

    This could lead to a flamewar so I will just stick to facts:
    Netbeane comes with out of the box support for j2me, j2ee, plug xml and jsp editors and java swing & awt gui editor ad a databse browser. Ergo, it has more features than any other open source IDE.

    Fat and buggy : mileage varies based on your skill set. Enough said.

    Slow : this argumment is in the same class as "java is slow". Valid observation from the past.

    No IDE can lead you to programming Nirvana -- you will still have to apply your brains. And therein lies your problem!

    I do agree with you on Netbeans Framework!
  45. Baloney.

    I work with Rational XDE (which is built on eclipse) everyday, and I have to say that it significantly slower than Netbeans 4.1 and takes 2-3 times as long to load.

    If you are running a decent modern computer (what does it cost for an Athlon 3000XP now? sub $500) with JDK 1.5/Netbeans 4.1, it is *pleanty* fast...fast to the point that it is not even an issue anymore.

    I've found most of the people making comments about Netbeans being to slow have not tried it for years or are still running on their 450 MHz pentium 2.

    Besides, the netbeans profiler, database explorer, JSP/JSF web app and web services support are hard to beat.

    To me out of the box Netbeans is just a more complete, full featured IDE for J2EE development than Eclipse.

    Mike
  46. Does NetBeans IDE 4.1 have out of the box Spring, Hibernate, Tapestry support ?
    No, it does not.
    With Eclipse i have plugins for all these libraries and much more.
    With Netbeans I do not even have a choice.

    Since Spring+Hibernate +(Tapestry) is becoming very popular bundle, it is another advantage of Eclipse.

    But rest assured, i'm unlike other Eclipse users do not think that there's no place for other IDEs.
    Netbeans is an excelent IDE for those who have chosen JSP/JSF path.
  47. Does NetBeans IDE 4.1 have out of the box Spring, Hibernate, Tapestry support ?No, it does not.With Eclipse i have plugins for all these libraries and much more.With Netbeans I do not even have a choice.

    The plug-ins for tools like Spring and Hibernate are just a matter of convenience and not at all essential: I use Spring within NetBeans with no problems.

    You may find with many products that plugins are unnecessary with NetBeans as it has both built-in Ant task support - any Ant task supplied with a product can be added to the NetBeans IDE as a keyboard shortcut or menu item, or added to the NetBeans build process, and it also has built-in XML support, so that (for example) Spring or Hibernate configuration files can be edited and validated.

    Much of what is frequently supplied as plug-in functionality for Eclipse is automatically available to NetBeans because of the additional features, like strong Ant support, built-in to the IDE.
  48. The plug-ins for tools like Spring and Hibernate are just a matter of convenience and not at all essential:

    Obviously, the same could be said about J2EE 1.4 support in NetBeans ;-)
  49. The plug-ins for tools like Spring and Hibernate are just a matter of convenience and not at all essential:
    Obviously, the same could be said about J2EE 1.4 support in NetBeans ;-)

    The Hibernate and Spring plugins for Eclipse manage relatively small matters such as configuration files. These matters can be handled using hand-editing of files without too much effort.

    J2EE support (in both Eclipse and NetBeans) manages such things as project structure, JSP editing, WAR packaging, JSP/Servlet debugging, app server control, http traffic analysis and logging.

    So, I don't agree that having J2EE support in either Eclipse or NetBeans is just a matter of convience.

    That is why I prefer having it fully-integrated in my IDE, as with NetBeans.
  50. NetBeans versus Eclipse[ Go to top ]

    Congradulations to NetBeans team.

    I have been using NetBeans and Eclipse each for many years, though the last two years I have gradually migrated over to Eclipse.

    The new versions of both of the products are good.

    The discussion of whether to use NetBeans or Eclipse is much related to what you want to do. Here are some factors:

    1. Based my own experience, Eclipse has a better plugin architecture. It is much easier to develope plugins for Eclipse and integrate existing tools as plugins. That is why there are lot more plugins for Eclipse than for NetBeans.

    2. As it comes to responsiveness and performance, I do not see much difference between Eclipse and NetBeans.

    3. Recently, NetBeans has done a good job providing facilities for J2EE development, and NetBeans team gets my outmost gratitude. Having said that, this is not something innovative. Say, EJB, has existed since 1999. If any tool, supports EJB development in 2005, is not something very exceptional! It is about time that IDE's supported by Sun and IBM had built-in support!

    4. For few dollars (e.g. MyEclipseIDE), you can buy J2EE support for Eclipse. Few dollars should not be an issue if you are a professional developing J2EE.

    5. NetBeans has an out of the box support for many standard technologies like JSP, EBJ and Swing. If this is enough for you, I believe the newest version of NetBeans is a good product. Having said that, the same features of available in Eclipse world as plugins.

    6. There is an active project called, Web Tools for Eclipse. It would be interesting to see the results of this project very soon.

    7. I believe that Eclipse is more flexible if you want to step outside the strict J2EE world.

    It is time that we accepted that there are two very good Open Source products out there. The Java community greatly benefits from competition and collaboration between these two projects.
  51. NetBeans versus Eclipse[ Go to top ]

    4. For few dollars (e.g. MyEclipseIDE), you can buy J2EE support for Eclipse.

    So if I want to develop J2EE stuff I have to download IBM open source Eclipse and 3rd party close source MyEclipse and spend 30$ per year

    So Eclipse is better than Netbeans, because I will have a lot of 3rd party plugins, which will hopefully work, will be hopefully compatible with other 3rd party plugins and will be hopefully cheap ...

    And free Netbeans (bundled with free SUN app server) with in house integrated and tested support for various JAVA technologies does not have any chance, because:
    At this point, it doesn't even matter how good NetBeans is any more.

    And because I work for SUN, my post should be deleted, because:
    public bashing a competitor is not professional and always backfires.

    hmm ....., I will think about that this night ...

    DF
  52. Is this possible ?