News: Best Open Source Content Management System, 2006

  1. A new award scheme was launched today by Packt Publishing offering a first prize of $5,000 and the title of best Open Source Content Management System, 2006. Voted for by a panel of independent judges and visitors to www.PacktPub.com, the award is designed to recognize and reward outstanding achievement in a high quality and highly competitive marketplace. Packt Publishing is currently looking for people to nominate their favourite Content Management System at www.PacktPub.com/award. The five projects that receive the most public nominations will go through to a final round of voting, with a panel of judges and votes from users deciding who receives the $5,000 prize. For more information about the Packt Open Source Content Management System Award, please visit: Packt Open Source Content Management System Award. The competition is not language-specific, so PHP, Java, C# CMS packages can all be entered; it might be interesting to see if a Java package is popular enough to win. Message was edited by: joeo@enigmastation.com

    Threaded Messages (18)

  2. Best bla bla bla[ Go to top ]

    Correct the title of your contest to, "Most Popular OS CMS".
  3. Unlikely, for now[ Go to top ]

    This will be obvious to many, but I'd like to see some conversation on this topic.. From my experience, PHP has much more energy and makes simpler solutions that seem to satisfy most people. And in most open source CMS charts, the top is dominated by PHP solutions such as Drupal and Joomla. This is an unfortunate state, because I think Java is a better language for large, long lived projects such as this (as opposed to quick one-offs that don't need long term maintenance), and it shows in PHP projects that have no test cases, constantly changing APIs that are pretty much being made up from the ground up release to release, as well as the lack of interoperability and inexperienced project participants, and an attitude of system-integrity-by-machismo (real developers work alone, and don't need the system to enforce anything). Using languages such as PHP, you can accidentally misspell or missuse a variable or have a syntax error in the middle of your code and things will merrily churn along. I'll take a little programmer inconvenience over this type of design any day. (and I'm sure I'm not the only one who finds a level of integrity to be reassuring). I mean, if you read a document like http://api.drupal.org/api/HEAD/file/developer/topics/oop.html, you can see it is rife with sort-of, kind-of, totally-misses-the-point-of concepts that are considered more concretely in the Java world. Java have taken the opposite approach and gone for glacially slow common standards and complex solutions.
  4. missing the point of PHP[ Go to top ]

    Your comments about PHP not doing things as correctly as Java is missing the point of PHP. The priority for PHP is not the elegance of the programming language, the perfection of the programming model, the beauty of the platform, or anything that is remotely programmer-centric. The priority for PHP is to provide a cheap, easy, and ADEQUATE way to build Web sites quickly for people, who don't give a rat's ass about programming. PROGRAMMERS DO NOT MATTER to PHP - cool Web sites matter. The philosophers driving the Java movement could sometimes use a stronger dose of this medicine. Easy things should be easy to do. Meanwhile, difficult things should be possible to do with proportionately more difficult techniques. PHP makes the easy things easy, while doing an adequate job of making difficult things possible (through C [dynamic libraries] and other techniques like integrating with Java). Java has not done as good a job of making easy things easy, because the minimum skill level needed to get anything done is still a huge barrier to entry for the typical moron Web site developer (incompetent programmer). PHP enables incompetent programmers to be wizard Web developers; whereas Java enables wizard programmers to be moderately productive Web developers.
  5. Hey Ben ;) I totally agree. PHP is a dog's breakfast, and apparently there has been quite a problem getting it to support modern features. Even the PHPers admit that everyone and their uncle discovers PHP, codes up a new framework in a burst of energy, and then discovers concepts such as MVC and encapsulation. Despite this, at some point PHP and Java are likely to meet near the middle in terms of language features, runtimes, and high level specifications. In the meantime, we're stuck with too many different systems on both sides, but despite all the hype, Java is still far stronger when it comes to important topics such as programming libraries and overall design (OK, not for everyone, but at least it has a design. ;)) For inexperienced developers, it is easy for a Java app to go wild with system resources, and classpaths seem to cause a lot of problems for people. Perhaps Sun and other relevant bodies could work on this problem intentionally to compete with enroaching languages and provide the best solutions for developers, and as well approach issues such as common components of an application that are causing an overabundance of incompatible "frameworks" that cause some people to run screaming to "simpler" solutions. Getting back to the topic of CMS and Web frameworks, which is of interest to a majority, there seems to be an issue of too much granularity (packages), too much abstraction (JSRs) or not enough granularity (frameworks). It'd be nice to see some rounded common classes, comparable to Quartz for scheduling, such as a User representation, that can be carried across frameworks, but at the rate JSRs are evolving, a considerable morass is likely for the foreseeable future.
  6. Have to agree[ Go to top ]

    PHP enables incompetent programmers to be wizard Web developers; whereas Java enables wizard programmers to be moderately productive Web developers.
    Unfortunately, this is true. However, the lack of productiveness I don't think is due to the language. When it comes to straight programming, using tools like Eclipse, I think a Java programmer can be more productive than a php programmer. Building a straight up website that just requires some database connectivity is difficult in Java. JSP sucks and the frameworks out there all have a level of complexity. Straight JSP is simply not possible for a sane person and JSF, well... Also, every Java project requires you to use mountains of third party open source libraries and you can lose hours figuring out where you went wrong in setting up basic stuff like logging, let alone Hibernate etc. With frameworks like Wicket and Google Webtoolkit I see hope on the horizon. And let's not forget about Matt Raible's appfuse to help you along. Back to the subject: best CMS. I've carefully reviewed many of the CMS systems out there and disagree with you that php system are very good in this area. I would even say they suck. They mostly are just oriented towards simple page/text configurations, can't handle structured content very well and have proprietary and inflexible content repositories. Some are more flexible but have horrible usability (e.g Typo3). Granted, open source Java CMS systems generally suck as well. OpenCMS is pretty good but Java CMS tools lack out of the box functionality. You have to build everything from scratch. I would say that imho the best open source CMS right now is DotNetNuke (mind you I'm all pro Java). It has a good amount of out of the box functionality, you can get to work immediately after installation without requiring programming, it has a solid architecture, plenty of community modules, is user friendly, etc. Anyway, Marc
  7. Re: Have to agree[ Go to top ]

    I would say that imho the best open source CMS right now is DotNetNuke (mind you I'm all pro Java). It has a good amount of out of the box functionality, you can get to work immediately after installation without requiring programming, it has a solid architecture, plenty of community modules, is user friendly, etc.
    First of all, DotNetNuke is not a CMS. It is a web portal system, which has some CMS-like features, but is not a general purpose CMS. Secondly it sucks. Sorry, that's my opinion. For a good .NET CMS and my vote for the best OS CMS: http://www.umbraco.org/
  8. Re: Have to agree[ Go to top ]

    First of all, DotNetNuke is not a CMS. It is a web portal system, which has some CMS-like features, but is not a general purpose CMS. Secondly it sucks. Sorry, that's my opinion. For a good .NET CMS and my vote for the best OS CMS:


    Java people once again getting very technical over a pointless issue!!! No wonder the best CMS is certainly not going to be a Java based one when people find it is important to post that DotNetNuke is not a CMS but a web portal with CMS features. May you be so kind as to draw the line between a CMS and a web based portal. To me the line is very very blurred and the most important thing is what you use the application for. If you choose to use DotNetNuke, Liferay or Drupal as a CMS then it is game to call it a CMS.

  9. http://www.umbraco.org/ Ok then, so why is it so good? I tried to find some decent documentation on the site, but couldn't find very much. I didn't see a lot of out of the box tools or a thriving developer community. It just seems to me like any old CMS without a lot of power. I did see that you had to use a lot of XSLT to implement functionality. No thanks, man! Your distinction between portal and CMS is a bit old school. IMHO, the distinction is starting to blur. If you accept the "boxy" look many "CMS-sites" have anyway, then a portal will usually offer you more features then a cms. And with portals like DotNetNuke, you can customize the "default look" away. The price I guess often being performance. Cheers, Marc
  10. is Jboss Portal a CMS then?[ Go to top ]

    Is JBoos Portal a CMS? Is it any good?
  11. Heard lot about it:I think this fits in well. Try out the link below: For a live demonstration or pricing information, please contact SyncEx at 847-903-2564 or 309-278-5279 or sales at SyncEx dot com Cheers Siddharth
  12. Re: Unlikely, for now[ Go to top ]

    Bottom line for the average user is the fact that I can host a php CMS for $10/month or less and with many hosts, I don't even have to install the app. I can do it with a one-click install thingy. Java will simply never be able to compete with this. I would love to be able to play with Magnolia or Alfresco, but because I can afford a website that supports Java/J2EE I have to stick with Drupal. When it comes to the web, quality does not matter as much as how easy is it to install and use and how much does it cost me per month.
  13. From what I can tell from Drupal's page, it's a website wizard or five for message boards. What am I missing here? Is this really an "Enterprise" discussion? Message boards?
  14. Drupal offers a bunch of out of the box and third party modules that cover a fairly broad range of functionality - see http://drupal.org/project/Modules - but usually in a skin deep way, and module support comes and goes. As well, the community has evolved and the support become more sophisticated... but use of the "E word" is misapplied, it is internet (communities and managed brochure) rather than intranet focused. I agree with another poster; a classic CMS is not what we are talking about, it's more like a CMS - DMS - Portal - etc hybrid. Most importantly to many people, it offers a programming space where interactions with "users," "content" (one of the actually interesting aspects of drupal is the fact that most content types are generic nodes with full versioning, although it has broken relational integrity), organizational features like the taxonomy system (which the internal community seems to be unhappy with), and internet protocols such as rss are provided generically. I am sure that similar features may exist for a particular Java based "CMS," but any amount of feature comparisons don't really make it clear what its like to use one of these systems; I certainly wouldn't know which to compare with Drupal. I am surprised that in Java-land there is no such thing as high level modules that can be plugged into different systems, it would be a "killer feature," but the closest thing (in my please-enlighten-me understanding) is portlets, but the user model and other common facilities aren't carried very far, which is great drawback.
  15. I don't know what the technical definition of Content Management System is ... however I've used Drupal a lot, have built several sites with it, and .. describing drupal as a wizard for message boards is completely missing the point. The core featureitis of Drupal is taxonomical classification of content and autogenerating navigational structure based on the taxonomy. That's a mouthful -- what it means is the site admin can create "taxonomies" where "taxonomy" is a $50 word for classification. Into a taxonomy you insert words which act as keywords. Then, each item of content on a drupal site can then be tagged with the words from the taxonomies. Then, using the tags Drupal can autogenerate navigational pages to string together related content. To give an example .. on my web site I made a "website" content type. For the "website" content type I created a taxonomy for the categories of websites. Now as I find websites I want to link to, I create a website node for that site, and in the category I put keywords describing the website. As a result Drupal automatically makes pages listing all the websites for specific category names. The result is here.
  16. This contest makes no sense[ Go to top ]

    It really makes no sense to select 'the best' CMS, because there is no 'best' CMS. It all depends on what you need. One person needs a simple one author small company cms, another a cms for a 20 person team, versioned, multi-language and for multiple websites. And then there are of course systems that manage documents like airplane maintenance manuals. You also have community sites, like for sharing photo's etc etc etc etc. Still, it is nice that Packt wants to stimulate OS. I just hope that they will be clear which criteria selected the winner.
  17. depends on requirements[ Go to top ]

    I used to work for a commercial cms system vendor (so I'm hardly objective :-). What separates the boys from the men in this field are features. Features such as listed for a lot of cms systems on this site: http://www.cmsmatrix.org. Many open source cms systems are a little thin on features. Compare for example GX WebManager (the system I worked on) and Drupal the system mentioned in the article. The difference is a whole lot of no/limited/free add on marks on important features and yes in most of the features for GX WebManager. And I can assure you the functionality is there (implemented some of that stuff myself). Does that mean that one is better than the other? Depends on your requirements really. The real issue is development speed which is determined by two things: how much functionality you need to add & how easy it is to add this functionality. Open source cms systems score relatively poor here. Lots of advanced features are missing in action and you are really supposed to layer a lot of development effort on top of these systems to produce a website.
  18. Okay ... Last year I spent a long time searching among the CMS offerings. There's some web sites that catalogue the available CMS offerings, even one that lets you play with sandboxed CMS installations that get reloaded every hour or so. That was an interesting search. My top two were Mambo and Drupal, and I chose Drupal. But as a Java programmer it was disheartening because I wanted to use Java. I think the core problem isn't the style of the language or implementation style of the CMS's in question ... it's more to do with the availability of web hosting for PHP. You can go to any of a zillion web hosting providers and get PHP support. Try finding JSP/Servlet web hosting? Hah! That is the problem more than anything. So what if there's all these high powered JSP appservers available? Yeah, they can build humongous corporate web sites. But is that the market these CMS's are targeting? Nope. These CMS's are well below the radar of those high powered appservers. Further, the typical web hosting provider has to keep their margins razor thin and can only afford the open source solutions. Hence the popularity of the Apache webserver. That coupled with the difficulty to integrate a Java appserver with the Apache webserver leads directly to .. no, not the dark side .. leads directly to the lack of Java presence among the web hosting providers.
  19. BTW, The PHP and Java worlds don't have to be disjoint. There's two ways to integrate PHP code with Java. One I like, the other I think is rather ugly. 1: The PHP Java Bridge uses the system from php.net and integrates it somehow with Java. The installation process looks rather ugly so I never got around to really trying this out. 2: The Resin appserver includes the ability to compile PHP code to Java. Its implementation is in Java, and I did a quick little test by running Drupal inside Resin. It worked fine, though I didn't test it extensively. I looked under the covers and found the PHP code compiled to .java files which were then compiled to .class files. The point of both is one can write PHP code, and in the middle of PHP code make calls to Java code. You can also make calls to PHP code from Java. That means you could have PHP programmers for the presentation level, with Java programmers to provide underlying support code ... Note that Caucho's code is GPL'd and someone could theoretically liberate their PHP code from their appserver and make a separate project out of it.