Could Abandoning JavaME Mean Greater Adoption of the Java Platform?

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News: Could Abandoning JavaME Mean Greater Adoption of the Java Platform?

  1. Could easing up on Sun's FOE clause, and giving up on the JavaME platform actually mean a brighter future for Java in other arenas?

    Apache, Oracle, and the JCK

     

    Threaded Messages (10)

  2. How?[ Go to top ]

    It's a stupd question.. When one of the three most important pillar of java platform is getting destroyed...and its the most promising one... JAvaME has been considered for the next generation as mobiles have become the revolutionary devices and more promising challenges are getting thrown by it..

    At this point of time, work on standardizing JAVA ME is getting reduced..Either we have come to the conclusion JAVA ME failed in deliverying the promise of the standard mobile platform or we have to make ourselves happy that android as open source standard and other technologies would replace in the open source scenario and compete with apple and microsoft.

     

  3. How?[ Go to top ]

    well said

  4. How?[ Go to top ]

    It's a stupd question.. When one of the three most important pillar of java platform is getting destroyed...and its the most promising one... JAvaME has been considered for the next generation as mobiles have become the revolutionary devices and more promising challenges are getting thrown by it..

    If the JDK can be successfully modularized, what need is there for the JavaME platform?  A lot of mobile devices have more computing power than most of the computers that ran Java back in the 90s.

    I guess I've always seen JavaME as a crippled version of Java, used only when you couldn't afford to run the real thing.  And I thought the main reason for it was that the JDK used too much space and memory.  Wouldn't it be a good thing to have an up to date Java platform for mobile devices?

    JavaME seems nearly obsolete.  Correct me if I'm wrong here.  I'm surprised by your comments on this.

  5. If Oracle does not ease up on the FOE clause and test suites, and successfully negotiate Google's Dalvik back into the official Java fold, they will find themselves outsiders and powerless in a very important technology segment.

    Google has already proven that Java can be forked successfully if needed but it would certainly be in the best interest of all to have the platform unified again.

    When I saw that Google had discovered that adding a JIT compiler to Dalvik would lead to faster execution I just shook my head that this has been allowed to spiral so far out of control.

    As far as the JavaME platform goes, I think meta-platforms are on the outs for the foreseeable future. The mobile space is up for grabs. Building the fastest, most advanced, technological marvel of an OS and, by extension, advanced applications; is going to be the one the primary drivers in this market.

  6. Lost[ Go to top ]

    Ok, I give. What is FOE?

    It's been a while since anyone at Sun briefed me on the ME marketplace. All I see on TV is ads for iPhone and Android (and many more Android ones at that.) How many handsets run ME? What organizations are making money on ME apps? Is there an ME appstore?

    -Frank

  7. FOE should have been FOUR.[ Go to top ]

    FOE should have been FOUR.

     

    FIELD OF USE RESTRICTION [general intellectual property-antitrust]. A provision in an intellectual property license restricting the licensee to use of the licensed property only in a defined product or service market.

    definition from the http://www.america.gov/

     

    A couple of links for more info:

    I reread my post and it came out a bit more dire than intended. Mostly I guess because I'm starting to have doubts about Java outside of the server side.

     

  8. Java ME[ Go to top ]

    Ok, I give. What is FOE?

    It's been a while since anyone at Sun briefed me on the ME marketplace. All I see on TV is ads for iPhone and Android (and many more Android ones at that.) How many handsets run ME? What organizations are making money on ME apps? Is there an ME appstore?

    -Frank

    Java ME is doing fine, TYVM. There's a huge and quite active marketplace for Java games in Europe. Advertising is targetting youth almost exclusively and the target phones are "plain old mobiles" and not the pricey smartphones, so it's not that sexy business with humungous margins.

    Another thing is that sales are done via operators, usually in the same as ringtone downloads are done. So you don't get one big Java ME appstore but those annoying commercials "Text JALIEN to 5657 to get Aliens vs. Predators game".

    Of course, the market is shifting to the appstore + smartphone way of doing business so this Java ME business model is slowly waning. Will it die out or will we end with some kind of a hybrid? Who knows... All I'm sure is that the Java ME as the (technical) platfom is dead one way or the other - either it will die off or it will turn into just a brand for a completely different, much more capable platform.

    Disclosure: I'm not a mobile developer, though I have a couple of coworkers and a former classmate who are.

  9. Java ME[ Go to top ]

    Ok, I give. What is FOE?

    It's been a while since anyone at Sun briefed me on the ME marketplace. All I see on TV is ads for iPhone and Android (and many more Android ones at that.) How many handsets run ME? What organizations are making money on ME apps? Is there an ME appstore?

    -Frank

    EDIT: gah, which idiot made this text entry component? It should drop quoting style when you press Enter.

    Java ME is doing fine, TYVM. There's a huge and quite active marketplace for Java games in Europe. Advertising is targetting youth almost exclusively and the target phones are "plain old mobiles" and not the pricey smartphones, so it's not that sexy business with humungous margins.

    Another thing is that sales are done via operators, usually in the same as ringtone downloads are done. So you don't get one big Java ME appstore but those annoying commercials "Text JALIEN to 5657 to get Aliens vs. Predators game".

    Of course, the market is shifting to the appstore + smartphone way of doing business so this Java ME business model is slowly waning. Will it die out or will we end with some kind of a hybrid? Who knows... All I'm sure is that the Java ME as the (technical) platfom is dead one way or the other - either it will die off or it will turn into just a brand for a completely different, much more capable platform.

    Disclosure: I'm not a mobile developer, though I have a couple of coworkers and a former classmate who are.

  10. I see JavaME as an obsolete fork of the Java language.

    At a language level JavaME is still based on a subset of the pre-Java-5 language.  This destroys the promise of WORA at the level of simple libraries and code snippets since outside of JavaME, Java has moved on.  Java 6 has been out for practically forever at this point -- and everything else is definite legacy.  This makes JavaME a technical ghetto from the outset.

    On top of this, mobile hardware is improving at a phenomenal rate.  This makes a modularized, pruned down subset of Java SE a better match than ME, which really hasn't been keeping up.  ME is an ancient fork plus new mobile libraries in some areas, whereas we should have a lean subset of the latest SE plus mobility libraries.

    Given all of these issues, it's no wonder that Google didn't want to pay Sun for the privilege of using JavaME and instead made their own path in the space.  The result: Android seems like less of a fork than ME.

    It's curious how wandering around and asking Sun and their ME partners at JavaOne about these issues resulted in a mix of brush offs and some queer explanations like "most JavaME partners don't want change".  In mobile more than in other technology spaces, e.g. the enterprise, if you don't change you die off, so this seems like planning to fail.

  11. Thanks for the explanation and update. I suppose that until my Google Pad running Java ME as an OS shows up I'll stay on the sidelines. :-)

    -Frank Cohen